Links mentioned in the video: Architects & Engineers for 9/11 Truth and benswann.com.
A made for TV movie:
Me? Well it does seem odd that fires could cause such a symmetrical collapse. And you would expect a collapse slower than free fall as the upper floors hammer each subsequent floor. I haven’t checked to see if the “free fall” assertion is true. That would require a forensic examination of the 9/11 videos. I haven’t done that or seen it done. But I’m kinda new to this and may look further into it. The second video with Ed Asner does a better job of showing the free fall in comparison to other buildings which were controlled demolitions.
But one point the first video makes is for sure true. We have lost a lot of freedom in America because of 9/11.
I wonder if the end of the Drug War was anticipated back then? After all Bush proposed taking 1/2 the FBI anti-drug squad and repurposing it to terrorism – until he was over ruled.
I haven’t done a conspiracy theory for quite some time. If you were having cravings I hope they are at least temporarily sated.
Comments
29 responses to “9/11 A Controlled Demolition?”
These guys are a bunch of charlatans. The collapse is classical and entirely what is to be expected from the collision.
First, the collapse has to be vertical because all the forces are vertical. No tall building can fall over sideways unless its supports are cut away on only one side. This was a gravitationally driven collapse that began once the fire had sufficiently weakened the structural steel.
The fall (not free fall) accelerates because as each floor collapses on the next lower the weight on the supporting columns increases. F = ma
If you want the details you can find a structural engineer nearby. Or you can read the report of the American Society of Civil Engineers:
http://ascelibrary.org/doi/abs/10.1061/%28ASCE%290733-9399%282008%29134%3A10%28892%29
You will have to pay for the report, but if you’re going to promote charlatanism you have to be punished.
By the way, it is generally believed that if the asbestos insulation had been applied to the steel beams and columns as designed, the towers would not have collapsed.
The free fall assertion is bullshit. Find a non-edited video (there are hundreds, at least, on YouTube) and time it yourself. In fact, don’t bother timing it, just note the difference in speed between the actual objects that have fallen off the building and the mass of the building itself. As for the “explosions” at WTC7, I imagine it gets loud when concrete building floors smack into each other.
Popular Mechanics did a pretty good takedown of the whole thing years ago. Well worth reading.
http://www.popularmechanics.com/technology/military/news/1227842
There are major problems with the controlled demolition theory:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_Trade_Center_controlled_demolition_conspiracy_theories
***QUOTE***
Engineers who have investigated the collapses generally disagree that controlled demolition is required to understand the structural response of the buildings. While the top of one of the towers did tilt significantly, it could not ultimately have fallen into the street, they argue, because any such tilting would place sufficient stress on the lower story (acting as a pivot) that it would collapse long before the top had sufficiently shifted its center of gravity. Indeed, they argue, there is very little difference between progressive collapse with or without explosives in terms of the resistance that the structures could provide after collapse began.[2][49] Controlled demolition of a building to code requires weeks of preparation, including laying large quantities of explosive and cutting through beams, which would have rendered the building highly dangerous and which would have to be done without attracting the attention of the thousands of people who worked in the building.[6][50] Controlled demolition is traditionally done from the bottom of buildings rather than the top, although there are exceptions depending on structural design. There is little dispute that the collapse started high up at the point where the aircraft struck. Furthermore any explosives would have to withstand the impact of the airliners.[6]
***UNQUOTE***
That aside, it strikes me as highly unlikely that in all these years no one has ever fessed up or ratted. Such a scheme would have been a lot of work and needed a team to carry it out.
Pancake collapse of concrete slab type buildings is quite common even in earthquakes (like in Mexico City) when the ground is moving.
Perhaps 1/3 of libertarians go for this crap. They are blinded by hate to the extent that they will believe any theory as long as America, and throw in Israel for good measure, are the responsible parties. It’s where the wacko right and half-baked left meet and agree.
What got my interest was that these guys were pro-Architects. And I watched it with my sceptical eye and the pieces seemed to fit well together.
Funny enough it was this review of Michael Mann’s book on Climate that got me started looking.
http://www.amazon.com/review/R2Z9NJVEA0L1D1/ref=cm_cr_rev_detmd_pl?ie=UTF8&asin=B0072N4U6S&cdForum=FxULZQNJUEUJD9&cdMsgID=Mx21PQB8KWYEL60&cdMsgNo=27&cdPage=3&cdSort=oldest&cdThread=Tx31HE8JDCITSF3&store=digital-text#Mx21PQB8KWYEL60
First off, controlled demolitions require a lot of setup time. These guys need to explain how walls got taken down, explosives inserted, and then restored – and none of the thousands of people working there ever noticed. Never mind the rest of the impossibilities surrounding this theory; that one alone is enough. Just because our government is stupid doesn’t mean they are responsible for all bad acts. There are stupid and evil people outside the US as well.
The other thing that got my attention was that in a fire the forces are uneven even if there is a collapse. So the expectation would be that the building would tilt and not pancake. Or tilt before the pancaking started.
And then there is the temperature of the fires which can be estimated by the smoke given off. Black smoke indicates incomplete combustion – thus a low temperature fire.
I had looked at this stuff back in 2005 or so IIRC and the people making the case were lunatics. I dismissed it. These videos are much better done with real engineers.
Believe? Well no. Disbelieve? Well no. And then there is this:
http://www.madcowprod.com/2013/09/12/the-fbi-took-a-powder-things-you-never-knew-about-911/
Mr. Atta was reported to have frequently done lines of cocaine in a bar. At least that was reported post 9/11 by a waitress. The waitress was paraded on TV. And then there was the flight school guy Rudi Dekkers. Busted for cocaine trafficking recently.
BTW if you watch the Ed Asner video you will see that WTC 7 goes down at what looks to be the same speed as a controlled demolition.
And as the architects point out: these buildings are designed for fires. In that regard WTC 7 is the oddest of the bunch.
There seem to be holes in the official story. OTOH how do you wire a building for demolition with no one noticing? Even using radio initiated detonators?
And then there is the thermite evidence in the dust. If this was Pittsburgh during the heyday of steel production – I could understand. But NY 2001? It doesn’t add up.
Would our “government” pull such a stunt to deprive us of our liberties? A decade ago I would have said: very very unlikely.
Today? I’m not so sure.
James,
Re your http://classicalvalues.com/2014/02/911-a-controlled-demolition/#comment-102037
I completely agree. That is a huge hole in the theory.
But there is a hint: elevator maintenance people and the charges placed between floors. The area is open because utilities are handled in that area. HVAC. Done at night over a period of months? Maybe. RF initiated so there are minimal wires? Possible.
But I do agree that is the biggest hole.
James,
I was writing my http://classicalvalues.com/2014/02/911-a-controlled-demolition/#comment-102038
At the same time you wrote yours. So my bit on “placing the demolitions is a big hole” was contemporaneous.
And my looking at Mann’s book was due to a comment at one of these posts:
http://wattsupwiththat.com/2014/01/30/mann-look-alike-thinks-manns-lawsuit-will-wipe-out-national-review/
http://wattsupwiththat.com/2014/02/01/michael-mann-the-reluctant-public-figure-and-typewriter-expert/
Here is where I got started: http://wattsupwiththat.com/2014/02/01/michael-mann-the-reluctant-public-figure-and-typewriter-expert/#comment-1556810
That would be: February 1, 2014 at 10:51 pm
The Atta myths debunked with links.
http://www.911myths.com/index.php/Atta,_alcohol,_strip_clubs_and_drugs
One of the strip clubs and drinking stories mentioned at the above link:
http://www.veteranstoday.com/2010/09/10/911-hijacker-mohamed-atta-the-unreported-story/
And FINALLY! Rudi Dekkers Behind Bars for Drug Trafficking
http://www.madcowprod.com/2012/12/14/finally-rudi-dekkers-behind-bars-for-drug-trafficking/
====
And Frank – I do agree that a LOT of unsavory characters are 9/11 truthers. But engineers and architects? Well I suppose they can be fooling themselves. But I tumbled to this from a Climate Catastrophe sceptic.
Well who knows?
Here is what the Climate Sceptic says about himself:
http://www.amazon.com/review/R2Z9NJVEA0L1D1/ref=cm_cr_rev_detmd_pl?ie=UTF8&asin=B0072N4U6S&cdForum=FxULZQNJUEUJD9&cdMsgID=Mx29ZF71FH7PI9A&cdMsgNo=29&cdPage=3&cdSort=oldest&cdThread=Tx31HE8JDCITSF3&store=digital-text#Mx29ZF71FH7PI9A
Here is an excerpt:
Hey, great sleuthing there Mr. Chapman, and Mr. (or is it Ms/Mrs/Miss) caerbannog. You got me. Now you’ve got another completely irrelevant reason to dismiss my arguments when you are unable to respond meaningfully to the scientific aspects.
Call me crazy, but I have this tendency to not just believe what someone tells me to believe. As a Professional Engineer, I am a stickler about details and confirming things for myself – my career depends on it. High quality data is essential. Correct method is essential. Believing something just because the government tells me that it is so is professional suicide.
I do not offer my name to the call for a new 9-11 investigation lightly. Why would I be so foolish to risk my professional reputation on a fantastical conspiracy theory? After all, my reputation is all that I have to go on. But I have looked carefully at the physical evidence, and I have examined the government’s explanations for it (through the NIST reports) and I have found them extremely wanting. In fact, from an Engineering standpoint, the government’s explanation of the collapse of all three towers on 9/11 is quite a lot of nonsense.
===
I dunno.
And our 9/11 Truther on the Hockey Stick:
http://www.amazon.com/review/R2Z9NJVEA0L1D1/ref=cm_cr_rev_detmd_pl?ie=UTF8&asin=B0072N4U6S&cdForum=FxULZQNJUEUJD9&cdMsgID=Mx3SLCHZ7B57C5P&cdMsgNo=33&cdPage=4&cdSort=oldest&cdThread=Tx31HE8JDCITSF3&store=digital-text#Mx3SLCHZ7B57C5P
And what is the nail in the coffin for me? That the government is promoting the Smart Grid™ a known very bad idea from a security standpoint. That is brazen.
Stop The Smart Grid
Happenstance? Or enemy action?
I could use some regular work to get my mind off the crazies.
[…] This is a response to my post 9/11 A Controlled Demolition?. […]
Simon, there is a psychological reason why people are looking for a conspiracy to explain away the events of 9/11. If a small group of poorly trained men can easily destroy the heart of capitalist America, there is no safety – for any of us. It’s a defense mechanism to keep from facing a very ugly reality.
For the past 12 years, and especially since the financial crash of 2008, I’ve been searching for reasons why the West appears to be in terminal decline. If Rand taught me anything, it is to be ruthless in throwing out specious arguments and irrational theories. You can lump the conspiracy theorists in with a whole range of people offering
“explanations” for our decline and growing vulnerability.
Jerry Falwell on 9/11:
“I really believe that the pagans, and the abortionists, and the feminists, and the gays and the lesbians who are actively trying to make that an alternative lifestyle, the ACLU, People for the American Way — all of them who have tried to secularize America — I point the finger in their face and say ‘you helped this happen.’”
Louis Farrakhan on 9/11:
“I want you to pay attention to this. I said, on November 25th 2009, 9/11 was done by people in our own government, and our own banking system, to perpetuate the fear in the American people, so that they might subordinate themselves so that the government may get them to do whatever they want us to do.”
Both of these religious leaders are in league with the professional architects and engineers who are desperate to blame the victims and their government for a catastrophic event that was the work of 19 rag heads from Saudi Arabia. People will do anything, imagine any scapegoat, to keep from facing the horror brought about by their own weakness, helplessness, and irrationality.
…brought about by their own weakness, helplessness, and irrationality.
Should read:
…brought about in the wake of their own weakness, helplessness, and irrationality.
Ed Asner? Let’s get Mary Tyler Moore to do an investigative report. I believe Ed Asner the way I believe Ben Stein about intelligent design. I’ve had to work with too many incompetent engineers to think a bunch of engineers and architects amount to squat. Out of all of al Qaeda only 19 out of 20 were even able to show up on time for their flight. They shot their wad on 9/11, what have they done since in the west? They’re good at blowing each other up.
If you want to obsess about government misconduct pick on the TSA.
Kansas city now… Lots of weird inconsistencies in the official story.
MMM,
Asner is just a talking head to attract attention. Did you watch the video?
The real show is almost all architects and engineers.
Well we got the TSA on steroids because of 9/11.
Frank,
If you look into the Venice airport where Atta was trained you will see what looks to be a drug running operation run by the CIA. Mena ring a bell?
And America’s decline? Well it couldn’t happen without a complicit population. We have lost our way. The people have become statists and the State is taking advantage.
Simon,
We do have a complicit population as you state, but there is more to it. I have a glimpse of a theory. You can call it my Conscience Theory of Decline. Simply stated it’s this:
If you accept Spencer’s idea of an Organic Society, then Western Civilization is suffering the end stages of death by guilt. WW1 was the starting point; the millions of Kulaks in 1921/22 and Ukrainians in 1932/33 starved by Soviet Communism and leading up to WW2 and The Holocaust being the zenith; and finally the forced blindness of The West as we have watched the butchery in Africa such as Ruanda and Sudan, and the Killing Fields in our old colonies in S.E. Asia.
How can any civilization, and I use the term with disgust, take part in or idly stand by such depravity? A complicit individual with a conscience couldn’t live with himself. So too, a society. It would self-destruct. Terminal guilt.
As good a theory as any, I suppose.
Yeats speaks of just retribution in his masterpiece:
The Second Coming
Turning and turning in the widening gyre
The falcon cannot hear the falconer;
Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold;
Mere anarchy is loosed upon the world,
The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere
The ceremony of innocence is drowned;
The best lack all conviction, while the worst
Are full of passionate intensity.
Surely some revelation is at hand;
Surely the Second Coming is at hand.
The Second Coming! Hardly are those words out
When a vast image out of Spiritus Mundi
Troubles my sight; somewhere in sands of the desert
A shape with lion body and the head of a man,
A gaze blank and pitiless as the sun,
Is moving its slow thighs, while all about it
Reel shadows of indignant desert birds.
The darkness drops again; but now I know
That twenty centuries of stony sleep
Were vexed to nightmare by a rocking cradle,
And what rough beast, its hour come round at last,
Slouches towards Bethlehem to be born?
I should have noted that my Conscience Theory doesn’t fully apply to America & Israel. The Jews were/are the victims of The West, and America was, but increasingly isn’t anymore, an exception.
Frank,
You want my opinion? If your conscience theory holds any water we are punishing Ourselves for complicity in Drug Prohibition. A game we inherited from the Brits.
At this point in time all the people at the top of this racket HAVE to know it is a War on abused children. They do need the money. But what they have to do to get it must be turning their stomachs. That is the trouble with Americans. The ruling class has always had a conscience. They do not shy away from murder. But they prefer to keep it to a minimum. And that is their undoing.
BTW I agree with Calypso Louis:
“I want you to pay attention to this. I said, on November 25th 2009, 9/11 was done by people in our own government, and our own banking system, to perpetuate the fear in the American people, so that they might subordinate themselves so that the government may get them to do whatever they want us to do.”
And there is hardly anything else I agree with him about.
Fallwell is an idiot. Totally.
Yes, the drug war is self-defeating for sure.
The other thing that’s opened my eyes recently is the knock out game. Why don’t people fight back, and why doesn’t society and law enforcement come down like a hammer to stop it? The only explanation that seems to fit is collective guilt.
You do realize that coupled with the 9/11 conspiracy theory is that it was most likely the work of MOSSAD or the CIA and MOSSAD together.
Frank,
Yes. I’ve heard MOSSAD. But it doesn’t fit. I’ve never heard of the MOSSAD in any kind of drug related operation. I’ll have to do some searching.
From the merest of searches it looks like at most the MOSSAD is involved in the money laundry. The CIA looks to prefer dealing. Well they need more money and laundry is no problem for them.
Well guess what: the Spotlight has the 411.
http://www.libertylobby.org/articles/2000/20000528ciamos.html
The Mossad looks to be peripheral to the story.
=========
Well isn’t this interesting. I have a link above to the same www site on the topic of 911. Different author.
http://www.veteranstoday.com/2010/03/12/drug-money-used-as-a-geopolitics-weapon-by-cia-raw-mossad/
And as a bonus 911 gets thrown in. Here is the authors take on the drug trade:
While international drug mafia is fully controlled by Zionists, CIA is complicit in global drug trade.
In my estimation it should read:
While international drug mafia is fully controlled by CIA, Zionists are complicit in global drug trade.
===============
My take? I think the clandestine services are getting out of the trade. Slowly. With control of the world banking system they can manufacture slush funds by manipulating bits. Much easier than moving dope.
In the long run it will not avail them. Control of very complex systems always runs up against the knowledge problem. Even knowing everything doesn’t help. How do you decide what is important?
After further investigation Veterans Today is a cesspool. That said it also seems to be some kind of intel set up.
What usually happens when I try to figure out the black world is my brain starts to hurt. It is impossible to figure out how deep the crosses and double crosses go. A Wilderness of Mirrors.
I prefer to avoid it and do my work in the open.
Here’s a final few thoughts about the 9/11 conspiracy stuff. If explosive devices were planted at ground zero, and it was just one of three targets with the Pentagon and White House the other two, then why did they limit the bombs to New York? Ease of access doesn’t fly because the White House could was a tourist trap before 9/11. And if the CIA & MOSSAD were involved would they really target the Pentagon & White House? As with all conspiracy theories, after almost 13 years why has there not been a leak? They must have been geniuses to devise such a fool proof plan with no holes.